Release device angle

[James Park]

I have now done some more testing on the effect of release device angle. That is, the angle at which you orient your release device hand.
To do this I have been using my Hooter Shooter, so it is very repeatable.
To date, I have been using my Carter Target 4 release and a D-loop.
When I have the release device horizontal in the Hooter, I adjust the sight settings so that I am hitting the centre of the target.
Then, I turn the release device to be vertical. The arrow hits about 2 1/2 rings to the left at 15M on a 40cm face (5cm). That is: quite a massive change. This prompts me to think that keeping the release device orientation consistent is quite important.
I think the variation will become more marked when the release device is oriented towards the vertical. Hence, I think that having the release device
more towards horizontal is probably the prefered approach (and it is also better biomechanically). (That is: about the angle I use it at, for those who have seen me shoot).

[NOCK HUNTER]

Very interesting stuff Jim, obviously this is some thing we should all be considering.

Looking forward to more of your observations.

I'm glad you bought the Hooter Shooter as I was considering getting one for the same reasons so you are saving me alot of time and money :D

[Flehrad]

Slightly off topic, but regarding the hooter shooter for recurves. Besides tuning with a "perfect" release situation, what tests could be done for recurve with that kind of device?

[Patchy]

Thats very interesting jim i was wondering the same thing as Ive swaping around releases Ive noticed ive had to change my sight settings slightly

[James Park]

For recurve: not applicable as the finger release is challenging to duplicate. For compound you use your normal release device.

[James Park]

I think that what happens is:
If the release device jaw is oriented to suit the orientation of the D-loop, it will be tolerant of release device orientation.
However, if the jaw is twisting the D-loop from being at a different angle then it will be quite sensitive to how much it is twisted.
Hence, for a normal D-loop we want the release device to be approximately horizontal, not vertical. (Of course, Clint's loopy would get around this, but I think it has other challenges).
Considering the biomechanics: what we want is to use only the muscles we need to use. If we think about the muscles that rotate the shoulder joint, we want them all to be relaxed, and in that case the relaxed orientation for the release device hand is in fact such that the release device should be tilted just a little from horizontal (about where I have mine), very suited to the angle we need to minimise this problem.
Having the release device vertical both maximises this problem, as well as using muscles we should not use, and hence I think it is not an optimum approach.
Of course, some release devices have rotating heads, and this will alleviate some of the problem here.

[2Dogs]

I think it may also explain why Peep height is important.

If you have the peep too low, I've found that as you get to the shorter distances you can end up rotating the release more vertical, and I find throwing arrows left or right.

I used to set my peep based on it feeling right at 70m. But find set it at my shortest distance and let the release hand float a little at the longer distances.

[Marcus]

The interesting thing though was with my Carter Just Cuz. I shot it horizontal and shot an X, turned it 45

[New Tricks]

I have to move my sight 20 clicks to the right from shooting with my Choc Addiction to mu Tru Ball BT. Both 3 finger and both held at the same angle. I would have thought I would go left with the BT not right (right handed). Have you tested such a thing? Can the hootershooter do BT release aids? I am guessing not.

[StevenB]

4 finger vs 3 finger?

[2Dogs]

Some carter's loadup more under tension then others. Maybe the Target 4 doesn't release as clean as a Just Cuz when twisting a D- Loop.

Guessing?

[New Tricks]

Marcus, what FG episode is that still from? I have not seen it and have most of them up to 5/15.

[Marcus]

not sure, it's a new one though, I have seen it, just once.

[James Park]

No, the Hooter cannot use a "back Tension" release. Needs to be a trigger.

[2Dogs]

What?....$4000 and it can't shoot a BT? :D.... Jim you got ripped :wink:

[James Park]

It can use a wrist release. :P

[New Tricks]

I have a fletchmatic in my quiver that is screaming out to be tested.

[OldDog]

You have to stop using that wrist release rhoid, You will go blind. :roll:

[New Tricks]

OK. Would that cause me to set my sight at 48 instead of 58? Thanks in advance.

[2Dogs]

Wonder if a Robotic set of fingers attachment could be made up to shoot a curve?

Ones that could adjust the speed at which the fingers "let go" of the string would be interesting also.

[Marcus]

That's funny NT cause I shot a Truball BT Gold last night, didn't have to move my sight at all, in fact I can't think of any release aid that has made me move my sight, can even swap between a trigger and BT release at 90m OK.

plot thickens

I have to move my sight 20 clicks to the right from shooting with my Choc Addiction to mu Tru Ball BT. Both 3 finger and both held at the same angle. I would have thought I would go left with the BT not right (right handed). Have you tested such a thing? Can the hootershooter do BT release aids? I am guessing not.

[Patchy]

That's funny NT cause I shot a Truball BT Gold last night, didn't have to move my sight at all, in fact I can't think of any release aid that has made me move my sight, can even swap between a trigger and BT release at 90m OK.

realy? All my shots go to the left when using a BT from a triger release.

Another point would just shooting off the release rope be any better than shooting from the d-loop ? (back to the hooter shooter jim)

[Marcus]

realy? All my shots go to the left when using a BT from a triger release.

Another point would just shooting off the release rope be any better than shooting from the d-loop ? (back to the hooter shooter jim)
Yeah true, Eberbachl and maybe primal (if he was paying attention) watched me do it last night.

[dbjac]

Marcus, Its the same with me, last time i was at DVA we swapped releases around, i went from shooting 10's with my insatiable to shooting 10's with Primals Zenith.

[2Dogs]

Having a bucket load of releases, I've found most do not shoot in the same spot when swapped.

However there are a few that do..... not many

[primal]

realy? All my shots go to the left when using a BT from a triger release.

Another point would just shooting off the release rope be any better than shooting from the d-loop ? (back to the hooter shooter jim)
Yeah true, Eberbachl and maybe primal (if he was paying attention) watched me do it last night.

Marcus. I'm always watching...watchingand waiting.... :behindsofa: . x x 10 if i remember correctly.

i can also switch from, my bt (zenith)to say marcus' just cuz and i have minimal movement on the target.
If you know the two release's the mechs are different. one opens towards the archer the other awasy fromt he archer

I think the angle is very important. I used to shoot with a 45degree angle on my bt, then went for a more horizontal approach. when i did shoot with an angle and stole marcus' just cuz i would have to move my sight.