Wheelchair FITA rules?

[Jimmbow]

Hi, I have a question about rules for shooting from a wheelchair in national/state indoor (or other comps). I would like to have a go in the next state indoor and need to know if this is governed by the FITA rules?

If so (and I assume it would be), now the real question?
From what I have read in the rulebook, when shooting from a wheelchair, the highest point of the backrest of the wheelchair is not allowed to be 110mm above the bottom of the archers armpit (ie. the backrest has to be 110mm or more below the archers armpit), my backrest is above this hight.

If I shoot in a few comps does anyone know if my scores will be legal or not or am I going to have to take to my backrest with a hacksaw:silly::).

I dont expect to get any great scores (as yet) but would still like to do it all correct.
Oh, and if I have asked this question in the wrong section of the forum please feel free to hurl abuse at me:).

[Hue]

that's an interesting question mate, be curious to see if anyone has an answer. Clare perhaps?

Hue

[Clare Barnes]

I know nothing sorry. All I can suggest that as far as AA goes it would be best to contact Vicki O'Brien.

Contact details are at http://www.archery.org.au/scripts/cgiip.exe/WService=ASP0009/ccms.r?pageid=10347

[The One]

Not sure about the legitimacy of the rules, but rather than take a hacksaw to the chair, you could always sit on a cushion :)

[Jimmbow]

you could always sit on a cushion :)

I did think about that (serious:D), but that would mean all of my practice would have to be on a cushion as well? And that would not work, would be similar to a standing archer to be only able to shoot with one foot on the ground or something like that:silly:.

[Ed]

Hi, I have a question about rules for shooting from a wheelchair in national/state indoor (or other comps). I would like to have a go in the next state indoor and need to know if this is governed by the FITA rules?

If so (and I assume it would be), now the real question?
From what I have read in the rulebook, when shooting from a wheelchair, the highest point of the backrest of the wheelchair is not allowed to be 110mm above the bottom of the archers armpit (ie. the backrest has to be 110mm or more below the archers armpit), my backrest is above this hight.

If I shoot in a few comps does anyone know if my scores will be legal or not or am I going to have to take to my backrest with a hacksaw:silly::).

I dont expect to get any great scores (as yet) but would still like to do it all correct.
Oh, and if I have asked this question in the wrong section of the forum please feel free to hurl abuse at me:).

All archers with a disability shoot to FITA shooting rules - i.e., equipment, scoring, etc, etc. What you are quoting (the 110 mm)
forms part of the IPC conditions. To be eligible to shoot as an archer in your situation you need to have a IPC Classification carried out by an internationally certified Classifier - you receive a card for this. This really only happens if you are shooting at a World Championship event or in the Paralympics. You don't need to concern yourself about shooting in Australia since we are not conducting events at these levels. At this stage of your involvement I would suggest that you just go out an enjoy your archery without having to worry about the above rules - no one here is qualified to classify you. When you reach higher levels then you will need to take stock of the IPC Rules. You can google the IPC Rulebook, etc for future reference
but don't get hung up on it right now.

[Bottom Dweller]

Its a very interesting question though.

I did a search of the FITA rules and there is no mention of able and archers with disabilities competing in the same competition. The IPC rules do however mention the following:

http://www.ipcarchery.info/Rules/rules_classification.php

"2.7.2.5 Compound bow
...
• ARW1 archers may compete in the Open Class of Compound Division with full Compound equipment as described in the FITA Handbook"

I'd like to think that once you have been "IPC classified" then you should be able to compete in tournaments against able bodied archers in any equivalent division/bow class.

[Ed]

Its a very interesting question though.

I did a search of the FITA rules and there is no mention of able and archers with disabilities competing in the same competition. The IPC rules do however mention the following:

http://www.ipcarchery.info/Rules/rules_classification.php

"2.7.2.5 Compound bow
...
• ARW1 archers may compete in the Open Class of Compound Division with full Compound equipment as described in the FITA Handbook"

I'd like to think that once you have been "IPC classified" then you should be able to compete in tournaments against able bodied archers in any equivalent division/bow class.

Mark Tomkins (Vic) has been competing against abled-bodied archers at both State and National levels for a few years now (he also shot in the World Championships for archers with a disability in Korea last year).
Incidentally - IPC is in the process of amalgamating with FITA so in the near future all the IPC rules, etc., will form part of the FITA Rulebook.

[Jimmbow]

Sorry for that, I did mean the IPC rulebook not the FITA rulebook. So in reality it would be better to shoot to the IPC standards even tho it is only in Australia?

Hypothetically, if there was a (slim) chance to shoot for Australia I would spend years training with one form (stance so to speak) and then have to change that form simply for going overseas and the results/scores would not be the same as the years of training?

I dont look to much into it or take it that serious, but as I said I like to do things correct and the main reason I am asking is that I dont want there to be questions raised after the comp/shoot is over.

Thanks for all the help:thumb:.

[Hue]

hi mate, Hue again. one of my wheelchair athletes has a special pillow that he sits on (for balance) it's not that high and has 4 seperate compartments that he can inflate or deflate. for archery, he inflates the two on his left hand side, facing the target as this gives him the balance he requires to hold his compound level, but he can remove his armrest from his chair.

Hue

[Jimmbow]

Hi Hue, I dont have a problem with balance and my chair is fine to shoot from the way it is, but would be a problem with IPC with the high backrest. I have no problem with changing to a lower backrest (apart from the fact that the backrest alone is more than the price of a new bow:silly:)

From the answers given so far, the backrest is not an issue for shooting in Australia, but yeah, will have to think about changes if I want to broaden my goals in the future:thumb:.

[Hue]

then go for it Jim, and kick butt!

Hue

[Jimmbow]

then go for it Jim, and kick butt!

Hue

Have not "kicked" for a few years now, but I get your point:thumb::D.

[DICER]

Hope these images help in any way. These are from the Netherlands where the three guys on chairs are competing for the Paralympic squad. I would think that their setups are FITA legal. The recurvers are quite good and compete against us able bodied guys, very efficiently.

[DICER]

The last picture is where a stool is used in place of the wheelchair.

If you want, I will see two of these competitors this weekend and I can ask the specifics for you.

Good luck!

[Hue]

Hi Jim

you can use a chair if you wish, but it really is for a classification known as ARST 1 archer (don't blame me, i didn't invent the class) where the archer can walk or stand, but for whatever reason, the sitting position is more suitable. these archers can retrieve and score their arrows if they wish. they always have some sort of disabilty in their legs or back. as i understand the para. rules, if you are "full time" in a wheelchair (wheelchair 1), you actually have to stay in that position for the full distance you shoot as it is deemed unfair to push yourself in that chair, retrieve the arrows, push yourself back and then have to shoot. that last bit, of course, is only for tournaments - at club level, i guess you make your own rules.

Hue

get on to the paraolympic site, i do believe the rules are there for you to peruse

[Jimmbow]

Hi, yeah, in the wheelchair full time so a chair is not an option. And have to give a big shout of credit to those who I shoot with at Tuggeranong, always offering a hand if needed and great people to shoot with. They have helped me out so much since starting to shoot at the range:thumb:.

And thanks Dicer, would be good if you could ask if they have ever had any issues with shooting from the wheelchair, not so much at an international level but any comps in general would be good.

Thank you for that.

[Jimmbow]

but it really is for a classification known as ARST 1 archer (don't blame me, i didn't invent the class)

Heehee, I have seen it written before but never though about it different until you pointed it out?
From now on I will be classed as the "arse'd" archer:silly::D.

[Hue]

keep the positive attitude, good to read. by the way, there should be no issues whatsoever with you going to a tournament. You're just another who wants to compete.

Hue

[Jimmbow]

keep the positive attitude, good to read. by the way, there should be no issues whatsoever with you going to a tournament. You're just another who wants to compete.

Hue

Correction: wants to "win":thumb: (jokes:D).

[DICER]

No problems - I will ask these guys.

[DICER]

Hi Jimmbow - I spoke with the guys I know here in Holland. The said much the same as in post #6. 11 mm under the armpits, but not to concern yourself to much, until shooting WC level.

[frommy]

As a matter of interest, can anyone advise whether this rule is in line with the one governing raised height of telescopes, in other words, so as to allow clearer filming?

[Ed]

As a matter of interest, can anyone advise whether this rule is in line with the one governing raised height of telescopes, in other words, so as to allow clearer filming?

No - the IPC rule is there simply to regulate the level of support given to the archer and was in place well before the scope rule came in from FITA.

[frommy]

Thanks Ed. :thumb:

[Dr Phil]

I know nothing of the rules or the logistics of it all but could you like that dude in the photo create a 'normal' chair? Maybe a folding chair or something to transport it that fits the rules? Can you do that?

[Ed]

I know nothing of the rules or the logistics of it all but could you like that dude in the photo create a 'normal' chair? Maybe a folding chair or something to transport it that fits the rules? Can you do that?

There are rules governing the chair/stool.
Firstly, you need to have a minimum disability of 38 points in the lower limbs or trunk.
No part of the chair may support the bow arm whilst shooting.
No part of the chair may be in contact with the trunk of the archer (i.e., you cannot lean against the back) and the chair must be at least 220mm under the archer's armpit whilst shooting at any distance.
The area of contact with the ground framed by the legs of the chair and the feet of the archer (i.e., maximum area taken up) must not exceed 60cm wide x 80 cm along the shooting line.

BUT, remember that all this really applies ONLY to World Championships or Paralympics events, as I stated much earlier in this thread.
I still maintain that you should go out and enjoy yourself at State and National levels without worrying about such issues at this stage.
In other words - STOP WORRYING ABOUT ALL THE IPC RULES!