Why don't people shoot more 3D????

[Brad]

Just wanted to know why more people don't shot 3D. What can we do to make it more popular???

Would really like some answers.

Brad

[Eberbachl]

Q: How can you make 3D popular?

A: Stop shooting IFAA 3D, and start shooting a good game such as IBO/3DAAA 3D.

IBO/3DAAA 3D is a much more archer friendly format, and unlike IFAA 3D is actualy shot at a serious level internationally, so those inclined to do so can go overseas and compete with the rest of the world.

IFAA 3D isn't really taken seriously by anyone outside Australia, and it's unfriendly rules just make it hard without being fun.

Check out 3DAAA - it's coming to a club near you soon :D

[Randall Wellings]

Stop shooting IFAA 3D,
the BAGMAN has returned...

Luke...P*SS-OFF with all your negative garbage..and for once in your life realise that your actions are

A REFLECTION ON ARCHERY...this game deserves more than your childish antics....geeze

Ohh...IMO
cheers

[OldDog]

Settle down Randall, Hes only sayin out loud what everyone else thinks. Lets face it the whole motivation for the dumbarse ****ing game in the first place was a masterplan to wipe 3daaa from the face of the earth.
Its about time they started thinking of the archers instead of there own malicious hidden agendas all the time. !!THEY SUCK!!

[grantwomack]

I don't have any inclination to shoot 3D simply because it is something that requires so many extras. Heavier poundage limbs, faster and lighter arrows, special points on the arrows, whopping great *expensive* targets and a big field to shoot that sort of thing in. I can see it working in a lot of places in the US and even over here provided you are outside of a city. But try setting up a 3D range in downtown Sydney. Not going to happen. But a target range, sure!
That's why I think it isn't more popular - too specialised and too difficult to practice with.

[Eberbachl]

Stop shooting IFAA 3D,
the BAGMAN has returned...

Luke...P*SS-OFF with all your negative garbage..and for once in your life realise that your actions are

A REFLECTION ON ARCHERY...this game deserves more than your childish antics....geeze

Ohh...IMO
cheers

Piss off Randall, just stating MHO

The question was asked how to make 3D more popular, and that's my opinion on how to do it :wink:

If anyone around here is a poor reflection on archery, it's you with your abusive, loudmouth, kneejerk posting against anything that doesn't conform to the Gospel according to Randall! :fist:

Have a nice day! :bday:

[2Dogs]

IFAA 3D isn't really taken seriously by anyone outside Australia

Is it taken seriously by anyone outside of Victoria?

IMO In this part of the world, the only 3D I hear about is 3DAAA. Which is good, they run it well.

IFAA should stick to promoting their excellent field rounds.

[2Dogs]

:rofl: ...geeez Randall, are you on the same medication as OldDog :D

[OldDog]

Have you been taking nice pills 2dogs. :D :D

[Marcus]

I have not gotten into shooting IFAA 3D, nor will I only because they do not allow binos on the course. This is also what stopsme shooting ABA, even though I have shot many high 380-390 rounds at the club, I will not compete in a field round that doesn't allow binos. Nor would I compete in a target round that did the same.
The IBO 3D game is a more sensible game with it's allowance to scope the target first, scope afterwards etc.
I agree, IFAA should stick to their field round, which is the best in the world.

[Randall Wellings]

whole motivation for the dumbarse f***** game in the first place was a masterplan to wipe 3daaa from the face of the earth.

I do believe that you are wrong on that one Noel...if memory serves me correctly...the 3D game of which you speak first showed it's ugly head in Ipswich many years ago..about 97.well before 3DAAA..

Syd was compiling the rules at that time for the International body and asked for submissions from all interested parties...the fact that he didn't take those submissions into account doesn't matter here.

I wasn't giving my opinion on the games as such..I doi agree that the IFAA game leaves a bit to be desired...

LUKE's drivel runneth over and serves no purpose

cheers

[Eberbachl]

I wasn't giving my opinion on the games as such..I doi agree that the IFAA game leaves a bit to be desired...


Maybe you should have been giving your opinion to try and answer the question instead of trying to just take some cheap shot. :angel:

LUKE's drivel runneth over and serves no purpose

...you just don't seem to serve any purpose full stop Randall :wink:

[OldDog]

Cmon you pair, cut it out.
If my memory serves me correct randall the game was first mooted about then but put on the backburner till the advent of 3daaa. It was then proclaimed as the death knell of 3daaa. didnt work tho. as a matter of fact it was and still is such a goat **** that it enhanced the popularity of 3daaa by a substantial amount. Why do you insist on defending the indefensible. One thing is for sure. They would never let that lot shake hands with the queen cos they **** everything they touch.

[Randall Wellings]

I agree, IFAA should stick to their field round, which is the best in the world.

Marcus...I agree totally with everything you said :o :o

Luke...everytime you sound off and cop some flack from me...you accuse me of being..
your abusive, loudmouth, kneejerk posting against anything that doesn't conform to the Gospel according to Randall!

In reality it is you who fails in his grasp of reality..your assumptions of me are based upon your destorted view of certain issues and the hatred that ensues is noted in your posts...you are a poor dumb unfortunate soul to which I extend every bit of sincere sympathy...maybe there is a medical condition which ailes you and to this end I will do everything I can to show you more tollerance...truly I will

cheers[/quote]

[2Dogs]

the 3D game of which you speak first showed it's ugly head in Ipswich many years ago..about 97.well before 3DAAA..

That was the inaugral Darryl Reeks 3D Shoot at Ipswich. Good shoot, because I won the money division by Defeating Noel Teelow in a shootoff. :D:D:D..snigger snigger.

Ahhh lets all get together at Nambucca Heads and have a big GROUP HUG.......then punch the crap outa each other in a rum induced brawl round the camp fire :D:D:D

Now ya gota be in that Randall :rofl:............Luke will be able to attend when his DR signs the release form :rofl: :rofl:

[Brad]

Look you lot I just want to know what 'I' can do at my club to get you blokes to shoot 3D. I don't really need to know what you think of the different governing bodies.

What things can i do/change to get you and your friends to our club to shoot 3D?????

I think it's a great form of archery that is underutilised.

[OldDog]

It might be underutilised where you are Brad but we have 3daaa archery available every weekend here in south east qld. Only because we got off our collective butts and made it happen tho.

Group hug with you 2dogs :o :o You gotta be kiddin. And in the banana benders corner weighin in at 190 The capricorn Killer, !!RANDALL WELLINGS

And in the pseudo taswegian corner weighing in at 5000 lb !!THE PINK PUSSYCAT!!


11111L E T S G E T R E A D Y T O R U M B L E

[Bruce]

My Gut feeling is that at the agm this weekend the IFaa 3D round will be discussed and I think there will be some changes to the way ABA run its 3D rounds . We have seen a decrease in the number of archers attending the 3D shoots hosted by the branch since the introduction of the IFAA 3D round . THe original 3D game played by ABA was much more servicable than the current round .
Also I believe that clubs need to promote what is going on at there clubs more They are hosting the events and people need to know what is going on . THe branch produces a calender each year but members need to be reminded . Let them know what rounds will be shot , wether a canteen will be operating etc etc

[OldDog]

Gotta take me hat off toya bruiser, When all is chaos you remain stoic and unruffled. Send me your ph. no. by pm. I would like to talk to you dude.

[Shermo]

Our 3d's have been even more popular since we introduced the complimentary BBQ. I know this sounds trivial but it works! :D

Our shoot fees are $12 per head (adult) this includes 30 targets of 3D, aswell as a BBQ of rissoles, sausages and various salads. Our club members seem to really enjoy this format, and all shoots are looked forward too. Could be an idea Brad? :wink:

We had a problem with people volunteering to set out the targets/cooking, but set up a roster and all seems to run smoothly now.

[Eberbachl]

Randall:

The only reason I get aggressive is because of the way you reply when I question something about ABA, IFAA 3D, or whatever. Look at your reply to my original post in relation to this topic. How could you possibly expect me to take it, when I was answering the question at hand with my opinion? As usual, your response wasn't called for, and that's why I reacted the way I did.

I promise to be more tolerant if you will. :bday:

Brad:

Andrew's post was great regarding what you can do at your club to get more people interested in shoots in general, but I reiterate that I think alot of your problem is the current IFAA 3D game you are playing. It's simply not archer friendly, is not a true international round, and people don't like it. That's all I'm trying to say, and your right this shouldn't be a debate over governing bodies, and I wasn't trying to make it one. I know your club, and some of the people in it. It's a great club, with great people. I'd love to come and shoot 3D there - personally the only reason I don't is because of the reasons outlined above. I don't like the game your playing.

Bruce:

Good to see that IFAA 3D format may be tabled at the AGM and modified for the better. ABA has the potential to put on a great 3D show and take it a long way. I hope some good comes from that discussion.

Paul:
:fist: :bday: :rofl:

Cheers,

Luke.

:angel: :bday: :angel:

[Randall Wellings]

I promise to be more tolerant if you will.

Done deal....see, it's working already :wink: :wink:

cheers

[OldDog]

:o What....... And i dont even rate a mention. You wait you pink shirt wearin bastard. LOL

[Eberbachl]

Sorry!

Noel:

:fist: :fist: :fist:

:rofl:

...there - that's better :bday:

[OldDog]

I feel better now 8) 8)

[Kuru]

Well as you can see from the replies Brad people don't shoot it because they don't like the IFAA 3D format plane and simple. I've shot it once and will not bother doing it again

[CMB50]

I gotta say that i havn't shot the IFAA 3D round, but from all descriptions i don't know if i'd bother. Plus it would also mean becoming an ABA member and that'd be like selling my soul to the devil. Not possible really coz i have it mortgaged 3 times over already, but that's another topic.....


Can someone who has shot both the IBO round and the IFAA round post some of the differences between them?

It's taken a bit of time for 3D at DVA to get up and running but if you persist and keep advertising etc, it will happen

BTW...which club are you from Brad?

[Paul]

Brad, why not have two targets together one shooting peg, vary the distances ie dont make all targets within the minimum/maximum ranges for that size target.
eg wolf shot at 50 yds. deer shot at 10 ft.

i shot DVA 3d sunday 5/10 and had a better time shooting this course than BMB's .

Vary the course, use more than 14 targets, DVA used 20 with 1 arrow shots (2 rounds)

[robbo]

I thought this was supposed to be an ABA forum.

All this thread seems to have ended up, is an ABA bash.

As far as nobody wanting to shoot the IFAA 3D, there are plenty who do shoot it and enjoy it, myself included. (I love archery, but I am pretty naive, I actually think we should all just get on with shooting, and generally get on :roll: ) I enjoyed shooting 3DAAA as well. Each has it's merrits. But to say one is vastley superior to the other is a stretch. This is has really gotten bitter from some people, there are a few personality problems, with people with an axe to grind.

I know the IFAA 3D could use a bit of modification, and I hope that it is discussed seriously at the next meeting.

Brad, I think one of the reasons that 3D is not shot as much as a lot of us would like is that it takes more work to set up the courses each shoot day.

With a paper round 1 person can easily set up the course fairly quickly, and some clubs leave the targets out permanently.

But to set up a 3D course it takes a few people and a little more time, and we all know how hard it is to get people to help.(most of the work done by only a handfull of people).

[mike]

And think Robbo, how much easier again to set up a target range!!!

[robbo]

And think Robbo, how much easier again to set up a target range!!!

True, but your not walking around in the bush and the fresh air.

[Eberbachl]

All this thread seems to have ended up, is an ABA bash

C'mon Robbo, this thread is far from an ABA bash :roll:

...just commenting on 3D games - not associations......

[robbo]

No????

My mistake. :roll:

[Eberbachl]

No.

:angel: :bday: :angel:

[Brad]

Robbo,

I don't think the setting up is the problem. With the way we've set it up it only takes 2-3 people and 20 mins to set up.

I have heard some say that they don't shoot it because it's too hard and they lose arrows. I've made the course much more user friendly (ie most targets closer to minmum distances etc) However i'm still limited by the rules a bit.

I enjoy shooting 3D and just wish it was more popular.

Maybe we (our club) need to look at starting up our own game. Take the best bits of 3DAAA and IFFA and combine them

[Marcus]

have you guys tried the 3DAAA/IBO game at BMB yet Brad?

[Brad]

No we haven't Marcus.

I'm not sure what ABA would say. The seem to not be too happy if you play other games than there's. Will have a chat to the rest of the committee and see what they think.

That's one of the reasons that we are so keen on the 'Triple Crown' you're organising next year. We really need to make things exciting for people to shoot and i think the 'Triple Crown' will be.

Brad

[BBS]

Brad
There is a real lack of barebowers in 3D why, they don't like breaking and losing arrows. last year at state 3D Wyndham more than 65 arrows lost on first day. also most barebowers get bad scores because the whole body doesn't count for score.

How to make it better
1. allow butts behind targets.
2. score whole body like a McKenzie target.
3. different distances for diff shoot styles, like IBO.
4. 1 scoring sytem not 3.
5. allow bino's
6. less pegs, 352 pegs for full 3 rounds.

[Eberbachl]

Hi Brad,

For what it's worth, I think in theory you can run 3DAAA games at your club without too many hassles.

A few years ago DVA ran some 3DAAA games when a couple of guys were trying to get it up off the ground here.

AFAIK what happens essentially is that the people running the shoot are just really renting the grounds and targets for a day, rather than BMB actually running a 3DAAA shoot, as it were.

No reason why those people running the shoot couldn't just happen to be BMB club members?

Anyway, for the shoot to go ahead, ABA wouldn't cover it insurance wise as far as I know, but for an extra $5 on top of the registration fee an archer can be totally covered by 3DAAA insurance for that shoot instead of joining 3DAAA for a year (which is only $30 BTW).

It makes it accessable, and means that people can try out the format to see if they like it before joining 3DAAA.

Also, it can be great for the club, and in turn - it's members, because all of the proceeds from the shoot can be paid to BMB as rental for the grounds and targets etc.

I hope that all makes sense, and helps :bday:

Cheers,

Luke.

[Shermo]

BBS I don't agree with butts behind targets, but everything else sounds good! Really it just sounds more typical of a 3DAAA style round

[Bruce]

Here is an idea to try Brad , Do what ever you like on your club grounds .
As long as it is a club shoot you are covered by insurance . you don't need to be affiliated with 3daaa in any way if you don't want to . Set the targets up however you want , use binoculars if you want , Hell even use a range finder before you shoot . While it is a club shoot and not an official branch shoot go for it :D You and your club members are covered as it is part of your normal club activities . Try some different games get some feedback and let your club ABA rep know about it , get the info back to me and it can be part of a submission to national next year to try and get some changes to the National 3D round . (thats if we don't like what comes out of this meeting , there may be some changes )

As long it is on your course , with 100% ABA MEMBERS in attendance you are covered , if your get some visitors from another association get them to sign your clubs vistor book and they are covered as well , no need fo a temp player form , Just sign the book that all visitors sign and away you go .Have Fun :bday:

[Marcus]

Lets us know when you try something new Brad and I'll try and drum up some shooters to come over and try out.

[Brad]

Thanks for all the input guys.

BBS, I don't agree with the butts behind the targets for 3D. I think it's a good idea to have a different peg for BB shooters so the shots closer for them. We do count the body already as we have McKenzie targets.

Bruce, visitors only need to fill out the visitors book to be covered by insurance??? If that's the case thats great, but are you sure?

Marcus, I'll be trying a new format in the next month or 2. Hope you and a few others can make it. I'll let you know when.

Thanks again

Brad

[Marcus]

keep it off the first Sunday of the month and we should be able to get some to go down. (That's our 3D day,every second month)
you guys are welcome to come to our 3D shoots, may help get your members excited by it.

[CMB50]

Keep us updated Brad, I'll definately come and shoot it. :D

[Brad]

Marcus,

When your next 3D?? I wanted to come last w/end but we were hosting the branch medalion shoot.

Also want are the rules for 3DAAA with regards to distances? I've looked at their website and the explain the divisions etc. Also the max distances for each division, but do they have max and min distances for each target group??

CMB50, I'll let you know. At this stage it will probably be on 9th Nov.

Brad

[Marcus]

not sure.
I think we are having one in December, first sunday of the Month. Will confirm and get back to everyone.
Will get back to you with the exact distances etc

[Eberbachl]

Hey Brad,

No target groups as such in 3DAAA, and use up to the maximum distances only. You don't have to worry about groups 1, groups 4 etc - just place the targets within the maximum distance for each peg. There is alot of scope for the shoot director to set up the course.

Some shoot directors like to make it tough, some like to make it fun. How you set up the course depends on the circumstances of the shoot. Personally, to start with for initial shoots, my suggestion is to make it more on the fun side rather than on the tough side and give people an easy introduction to the format. It's my personal experience that alot of people who haven't shot 3D, or people that have tried it but won't try it again shy away from it because of the fear of losing and breaking arrows. It will still be tough for the more competent archers to shoot perfect rounds if you set it up in a more forgiving manner to start with, but it means less lost/broken arrows and heartache for people less advanced. Use your discretion.

Another suggestion we have tried at DVA that has been met with some enthusiasm is to allow beginners (at 3D) to shoot in a semi marked group as a method of introduction to the format. This means that those archers are given the target distance, to within - say five metres for each target.

EG:

Target 1: 17-22
Target 2: 36-41
Target 3: 29-34

etc etc....

It significantly increases the amount of rubber new 3D archers hit, and gets them used to judging distance on a field course. Those archers in the semi - marked group would not be in contention to take out the shoot from the unmarked shooters, as it is an introductory thing only.

Hope this helps....

And BTW - would love to come and shoot some 3D like this at BMB if you're going to run it!

Cheers,

Luke.

:angel: :bday: :angel:

[Brad]

Thanks for that Marcus and Luke.

I've had preliminary discussions with a few people at the club and they seem keen.

Will let you know when the first will be.

Brad

[BBS]

Brad and Andrew
The Q was why don't more people shoot 3D and for a lot of the non-shooters it is lost and broken arrows, hence butts behind targets.

Personally the harder the better, a few years ago at Lilydale we had a guy running 3D that would put targets in front of trees, half obscured by trees (could see the 20 ok but not the rest), there were lots of trees shot. Not one target in a ABA or IFAA shooting lane, would stumble through the bush over 2 or 3 of the ABA courses. I really liked the layout except for all the walking, was really a challenge. As a result of the layout the numbers really fell off, we were getting 10 people to a shoot and this was at a time when we had 180 plus members. Dennis now makes it really user friendly and the numbers are up even though membership is down.

I used to shoot simulated field and the club I was at had a policy of making most targets easy so beginners/intermediate shooters did not get discouraged and have a few (3 or 4 out of 25) that are hard so the good shooters don't all get a perfect score.

[Brad]

Well everyone, i've organised a 3D shoot for the 9th of Nov. It will be shot along the lines of 3DAAA.

There will be a free BBQ on the day. We will be starting at 10am with muster/bowcheck at 9.30.

Hopefully we can get a few of you archers from other clubs to come and try it. I would really some feedback. You don't need to be a member of ABA to shoot.

Look forward to seeing you.

Brad

PS If you don't know where Bacchus Marsh Bowmen are located you can PM me.

[Eberbachl]

Sounds great Brad!

Well done :D

I'll make every effort to attend :wink:

[Brad]

Sorry guys but i've decided to try the new format at a later date. Southern Grampians have their 2 day ABA shoot on that weekend so i will be going there to shoot.

I'll try to organise a 3DAAA soon but xmas is fast approching and i'm running out of w/ends.

We'll definately be having shoots like that next year

Brad

[Eberbachl]

No worries Brad,

We look forward to coming and having a shoot with you when you get the chance.

Cheers,

Luke.

:bday:

[mbomike]

Brad...
Did you get your 3D shoot up and running?

[Brad]

Yeah we have shot 3D with IBO type rules the last couple of club shoots. It's been fantastic. Only 1 lost arrow and know broken ones!!!!!!

We are holding a 2Day shoot in march and it will be the new format 3D as well as an ABA paper round. Hopefully we will get a good turnout and people can see how much fun 3D can be.

I'll be putting a post up in the next day or two to let everyone know what's happening.