How much tranning

[Robert43]

Hi how much tranning ie time or arrows would you recommend for a 10 year old boy shooting a 24lb cmpound bow?. Also what other tranning do you recommend other than shooting the bow? . Thanks Robert

[clever_guy]

fstop43;

One or two sessions a week, half an hour or an hour in length, depending on the child's interest. You have to be careful with younger kids and archery, they can develop physical problems from over-shooting. It is a good idea to have them involved in a more active sport like say soccer, and then have archery as a second sport.

Here is a thread on the same topic from another forum:

http://sagittarius.student.utwente.nl/bb/viewtopic.php?t=80

-CG

[Marcus]

It is a good idea to have them involved in a more active sport like say soccer, and then have archery as a second sport.

Great way to produce ordinary archers. ;)

Our top juniors train from hat age for about 18-22 hours a week.

I think one thing that is wise is try to give them the opportunity to shoot at least once a week, twice if possible. However I think it's good to make sure they don't see archery as a casual thing, but rather something that takes time and dedication. They will be in the sport longer and be better at it.

[robbo]

If time permitted, I would encourage my kids to train twice a week.

But with school and home work, football, squash(winter) and athletics, tennis, swimming, cricket etc in the summer, time is a bit short. Plus nowhere close to train(18 km to the club and no facilities to shoot indoors or at night) :-?

So we probably average one training session per fortnight of about30 - 45 minutes.

If you have access to some where you can shoot regularly, then two or three times a week for up to an hour.

And when they get to a level where they wish to get serious, then they will need to put more time in as Marcus said.

The better they get, generally the more they enjoy it an the longer they will stay in the sport. IMHO :D

[clever_guy]

"Our top juniors train from hat age for about 18-22 hours a week."

There are no top juniors at 10 years old *anywhere* in the world - there are just 10 year olds who fling arrows more than other 10 year olds. Kids that age are better served by being primarily involved in more active sports. If they do well they can increase their training regiment as they get older (say over 12-14 years old). First you want kids to be athletic and in good physical condition - then you want to look at archery, when they get older (teens) they can then increase the proportion of archery training to where they are training at higher levels. The only thing you get out of training 10 year olds excessively, are poorly conditioned kids, or kids that over do archery and leave the sport. There is also a greater risk of injury due to repetitive stress, this includes bone-end injuries, which can impact a person for the rest of their lives

-CG

[Marcus]

Teens is too late to get started in archery if you want them to be the best. In my experiance the kids suffer when they are doing too many activities at once. For example if they are playing 4 sports they don't get good enough at archery to stick with it.
Have your 10 year old shoot once a week then when they are 14 have them come up against the 14 year old I've been training for 4 years and see what scores they shoot. Then again at 16. By then it's too late, they will get hammered. This is the reality of sports today. Yes in archery you canstart at any age and do well, but it's the ones who are trained right from a young age who dominate.
The kids who have taken on archery as their focus are representing the country and getting far more from it. They are also healthier and in good physical condition.
I think it's fine to encourage an active lifestyle outside of archery, however if you encourage it too much and they excel in the other sport then say goodbye to them.

"Our top juniors train from hat age for about 18-22 hours a week."

There are no top juniors at 10 years old *anywhere* in the world - there are just 10 year olds who fling arrows more than other 10 year olds. Kids that age are better served by being primarily involved in more active sports. If they do well they can increase their training regiment as they get older (say over 12-14 years old). First you want kids to be athletic and in good physical condition - then you want to look at archery, when they get older (teens) they can then increase the proportion of archery training to where they are training at higher levels. The only thing you get out of training 10 year olds excessively, are poorly conditioned kids, or kids that over do archery and leave the sport. There is also a greater risk of injury due to repetitive stress, this includes bone-end injuries, which can impact a person for the rest of their lives

-CG

[clever_guy]

"Have your 10 year old shoot once a week then when they are 14 have them come up against the 14 year old I've been training for 4 years and see what scores they shoot. Then again at 16. By then it's too late, they will get hammered. This is the reality of sports today. Yes in archery you canstart at any age and do well, but it's the ones who are trained right from a young age who dominate."

The reality is that kids that are 10 years old do not have the fine motor-skills, concentration, or over all maturity (physical or mental) to really excel at archery like you are trying to build a case for. Those skills don't develop in most kids until their teens. So an extra 4 years putzing at archery when they could be developing overall co-ordination and fitness isn't going to do much. You analogy is incorrect, and I *guarantee* I can train a fit, coordinated 14 year who has been playing other sports to compete on the same level as a kid who has been just shooting archery for 4 years - it's pretty easy. And as far as having kids stick in a sport, it is more likely a kid will drop archery after spending 4 years in a sport (say 10-14) and then get squashed by some new kid who just started - which happens frequently. On the other hand, if they have a balanced experience with a number of sports, they can have success on a variety of levels, and more easily match desires with outcomes, and have a realistic perspective which helps them in setting and attaining goals. As well a teen
that has a basis in active sports will tend to have a higher overall fitness, strength, co-ordination, and personal outlook - which will increase the chances that they will adapt to a high-level archery program.

Don't think this is a phenomena that is restricted to kids/teens. Cross-over athletes have a better chance of moving from one high-level athletic program to another because of their fitness and sporting development. So a track star or football star can more easily make the switch to becoming a high level bobsled athlete, than someone who has just been training through a junior through intermediate program for bobsled. If it was lucrative enough you would see more adult high-level athletes from other sports cross over into archer and compete at a high level as well.

-CG

-CG

[Robert43]

Hi I get him to tran about 1 or 2 a week we do it at home bottom lounge room throught door way to under hose is 13.5 meters and He does Kae kwon do 1 hour a week plus tranning by himself . How can I tell if the bow is too strong /weak (compound bow) ie but the amount of arrows in a hour and still able to pull the bow ok? (set at 24lb)
He is large build 11 in November but seems to take forever to shoot (sights) the bow wanders around. I have told him to take only 3 second to shoot is this reasonable. He watchs me and I can hold a bow a lot longer naturally.
Thanks Robert

[clever_guy]

http://www.archerytalk.com/vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=83549

"..if you can't sit in a chair with your feet off the ground and draw your bow level with a target smoothly - you are over bowed. If you have to "sky draw" or yank the string in a jerking fashion to get over the can hump - you are over bowed. If your drawing shoulder or bow shoulder is very tender after shooting - and sore the next day, something is wrong.."

Similar thread/issue. With kids you have to be more careful though, and gauge their progression in shooting volume and draw weight. Kids are constantly growing in cycles so the chances of muscle/tendon/bone injuries from repetative stress of shooting archery are higher than in adults - and can potentially lead to long term problems. If they have muscular or joint soreness after shooting or shake excessively when aiming, reduce the shooting duration or have them take a break for a week or two, and see what happens. You have to play it by ear. As a general rule of thumb, if he can draw back the bow level with the target sitting with his feet off the ground, and hold it for ~10 seconds, he is ok. Holding too long while aiming isn't going to do him any good, it will lead to more errors as he moves outside optimal holding time. Instead get him to draw into the gold (x), and then release within 3-5 seconds, and don't use a scope, as it encourages kids to over-aim.

Have fun,

-CG

[Robert43]

I just tried him sitting on a chair he pulled the bow back ok feet off the ground and held the bow steady for 14 seconds then complatied and shot within 2" of the x at 18 feet, so I would presumed he isnt over bowed.
Its hard to teach him due to my limited knowlage only done it for 15 months and no coach here to speek Robert

[Mark]

"

The reality is that kids that are 10 years old do not have the fine motor-skills, concentration, or over all maturity (physical or mental) to really excel at archery like you are trying to build a case for. Those skills don't develop in most kids until their teens.


-CG

I think I should chime in here. I started at around 11 years old over 20 years ago and aside from issues of physical size shooting recurve took to archery like a duck to water. Picked up a compound and by the time I was thirteen was out shooting most seniors at our club, by fifteen I was shooting 540 plus IFAA rounds. This was at the club and in competition, without dedicated coaching by anyone and with archaic equipment by todays standards. Whilst I agree that there are physical issues to deal with from over shooting (ask my chiro from back then), the focus I had came from almost the day I started and, I know, you will probably point out I shot my best as a teen, but it started well before that. Kids have the ability to focus and develop archery skills at a very young age.

Mark

[clever_guy]

"started at around 11 years old over 20 years ago and aside from issues of physical size shooting recurve took to archery like a duck to water."

15 years old or 13 years old is different than 10 years old. That's why I said They can "increase their training regiment as they get older (say over 12-14 years old)". Fine motor-skills, concentration, or over all maturity (physical or mental), all develop over time and when kids get into their teens (and at what point in their teens varies from kid to kid), that is when they have the requisite development to really pursue archery. At 10 though, they aren't likely to do anything but fling arrows, most kids don't do much more than that until they get into their middle teens. At 11 you may have good concentration and strength for an 11 year old, but you don't have the concentration of the average 15 year old or adult. And even if you have exceptional concentration you don't have the other requisite skill sets to shoot at a the higher competitive level - this is why you don't see 10-15 year olds in generally involved in archery at those levels (there are always exceptions though like Darrel Pace, Karen Scavatto, Dave Barnes, etc). Archery is a sedentary sport with a very specific skill set, a 10 year old is much better served by developing overall coordination, being active (running), and developing social skills (team sports).

I started shooting in a JOAD program when I was about 12, along with other sports - and did well, and due to interest I increased my participation in archery accordingly as I got into my mid and later teens. There isn't anything wrong with having archery as the primary sport for the average teen when they hit their mid teens, and increasing the training schedule as required to participate in a high performance program (with some caution as they are still growing). I wouldn

[The One]

bout 25 hours a day, 8 days a week sounds good to me :D:D:D

Seriously, though, I believe that kids who are aged around 10-12 and train more and go to tournaments will most likely have a better prospect in the future. If there's one thing that would be good about being that age, is that it would be easier to train in the sub-conscious stuff, and to some extent, the mental stuff. For children looking to compete in the future, getting used to shooting arrows in the gold is invaluable mental training - never underestimate this!

Of course, that being said, overdoing it could flip the tables a bit, and turn them away from the sport depending on their attitude. It is so often teenage archers who turn away from the sport - I've seen a good 20 or so, both in my club and in others, replace archery with other social activities. This is to some extent understandable, but all the same, it's a shame for the sport, and perhaps we need to understand how we can retain these archers better.

[frommy]

Interesting discussion, with several points of view.

My only comment is in relation to an interview on ABC TV last night with Kieran Perkins (C-G, a now retired fabulous swimmer from Oz in case you are not familiar with the name) who stated that he wished he had participated in more variety of sport in his pre-teen years.

He admitted to being totally eye/hand uncordinated by not participating in sports other than swimming.

Just a thought. :-?

Brian

[recurve boy]

If there's one thing that would be good about being that age, is that it would be easier to train in the sub-conscious stuff, and to some extent, the mental stuff.

This is funny because down at the SOAP club, there are a couple pretty good under 12s. I saw them shooting once and was quite impressed at their groupings. Then they go and shoot a stray arrow ... I watch them longer and this happens to be a recurring theme. Apparently all the kids are like that. They can't quite keep their focus. I don't think they're really paying heed to the mental stuff all that much! :D

I agree with CG though. Kids need to do other things. Considering the AIS programme, they would be better served if they did other sports. Easier to pass the beep test requirements. I hear there's a girl down there now, about 12ish. Shooting over 1100 already ... I have a lot more work to do. Don't like being beaten by kids :P

[The One]

Yeah, I'm not saying that they shouldn't participate in other sports. And anyway, I seem to shoot off stray ones every other end as well!