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Thread: Modify Your Recurve Bow Grip

  1. #1
    Recurve's Rule ! Leftnut's Avatar
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    Modify Your Recurve Bow Grip

    Here is an interesting write up on a U.S.archery web site called.
    The BEST Method
    Biomechanically Efficient Shooting Technique

    A moderately low wrist position is stronger and
    more forgiving when shooting lots of arrows. This wrist
    position also directs the force of the bow directly
    through the bones and minimizes the fatigue of holding
    the wrist in an unnatural position. However, it is
    common for elite archers to customize their bow grip,
    often making it moderately high.
    A customized grip
    that aides in getting
    consistent hand placement can be very valuable and if properly designed can
    compensate for the normally weaker low wrist position. The grip modification shown
    below will benefit the biomechanics of the bow arm, improve bow hand stability and
    compensate for bow hand torque. Properly designed, the modified grip will help the
    archer develop the correct hand position and consistent “feel.” The bow hand
    position must be natural and never forced. The grip can be modified by adding epoxy
    putty to the plastic grip and shaping it with a rasp.
    To summarize, the foundation of the shot focuses on arranging the body and its component parts into the
    strongest and most stable configuration possible prior to the application of internal and external forces. This is
    accomplished by proper “load bearing” alignment that reduces fatigue and the potential for injury. Establishing
    stability will reduce movement during the shot and increase the archer’s sense of confidence. The foundation
    must, in every instance, be established precisely the same way every time to create consistency. The
    foundation also sets the tone for the shot and supports the shot, making it easier to execute and thus easier to
    duplicate. The design of this set of foundation positions is supported by carefully observed biomechanical and
    physical principles. It is the most efficient and effective way to perform an archery shot.
    ( Here is a modified GMX grip )
    Attached Images Attached Images  
    Recurve's Rule !

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  3. #2
    Recurve's Rule ! Leftnut's Avatar
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    Here is another one from Coach Kim from Korea, I think I've put this up before but what the hell.
    Recurve's Rule !

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  5. #3
    Recurve's Rule ! Leftnut's Avatar
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    Here is another example, I think it was Simon Fairweathers bow.
    Attached Images Attached Images  
    Recurve's Rule !

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  7. #4
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    I don't agree with those types of modifications at all.
    Usually they are not fixing faulty hand placements on the bow - trying to fix one fault by introducing another.
    It is much better to get the biomechanicals correct to start with.
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  9. #5
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    My point is:
    Hoyt (and others) make excellently shaped recurve grips (although I do not like the BEST grip - the angles are wrong).
    If you have a correctly positioned bow hand the force from the bow will be on the thumb muscle and from there directly onto the radio-carpal joint.
    If the force passes directly through that joint there will not be any tendence for your bow hand to slip, and you do not need rubber grips/etc or to change the shape of the grip to keep it in place. It is also the strongest position for your bow hand and minimises muscle use. In addition, it promotes the best position of the upper arm, giving optimal string clearance, and minimises use of the rotator cuff (and minimises the likelihood of injury).

    Usually when I see archers changing the shape of the grip it is because they have an incorrect bow hand position to start with.

    Same goes for compound bows - it is usually easily possible to get your bow hand in the correct position without making any modifications (at least it is for the Hoyts and many others). The most common error I see there is archers having their hand angle too vertical and the palm touching the grip.
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  10. #6
    Recurve's Rule ! Leftnut's Avatar
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    Maybe like Jager and Best you should start your own bow grip brand and prove them wrong inc. Coach Kim Hyum Tak who has numerous people he has coached go on to take gold who also has been brought over by Archery Aust. to coach the Shadow squad ?
    Quote Originally Posted by James Park View Post
    My point is:
    Hoyt (and others) make excellently shaped recurve grips (although I do not like the BEST grip - the angles are wrong).
    If you have a correctly positioned bow hand the force from the bow will be on the thumb muscle and from there directly onto the radio-carpal joint.
    If the force passes directly through that joint there will not be any tendence for your bow hand to slip, and you do not need rubber grips/etc or to change the shape of the grip to keep it in place. It is also the strongest position for your bow hand and minimises muscle use. In addition, it promotes the best position of the upper arm, giving optimal string clearance, and minimises use of the rotator cuff (and minimises the likelihood of injury).

    Usually when I see archers changing the shape of the grip it is because they have an incorrect bow hand position to start with.

    Same goes for compound bows - it is usually easily possible to get your bow hand in the correct position without making any modifications (at least it is for the Hoyts and many others). The most common error I see there is archers having their hand angle too vertical and the palm touching the grip.
    Last edited by Leftnut; 25th April 2012 at 10:23 PM.
    Recurve's Rule !

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  12. #7
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    Except what Jim is saying is, you don't need to make a grip.... like as he says, I also no longer apply tape/grip material, nor modify my grip at all. The grip that came with my Formula RX is really nice, and I find I can get a fantastic position that never slips or twists when I shoot, even when my hand is damp. When its drenching wet though, thats a slightly different issue as my hand slips in deeper to the throat.
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  13. #8
    Recurve's Rule ! Leftnut's Avatar
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    So your saying Bradey Ellison Shouldn't modify his grip either ?
    Quote Originally Posted by Flehrad View Post
    Except what Jim is saying is, you don't need to make a grip.... like as he says, I also no longer apply tape/grip material, nor modify my grip at all. The grip that came with my Formula RX is really nice, and I find I can get a fantastic position that never slips or twists when I shoot, even when my hand is damp. When its drenching wet though, thats a slightly different issue as my hand slips in deeper to the throat.
    Recurve's Rule !

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  15. #9
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    I am saying (and I don't care who the archer is): get your bow hand in the correct position to start with and don't rely on grip tape or changing the shape of the grip to try to fix a poor bow hand position. My experience is that with the standard grips (such as the one on my Hoyt Nexus) that is easily possible. I have looked at many archers and would guess that at least 50% have poor hand positions - often it arises from poor upper arm positions or trying to have the hand too vertical.
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  16. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Leftnut View Post
    So your saying Bradey Ellison Shouldn't modify his grip either ?
    Unless your body, technique and skill is the same as his, why would you feel you should copy him? Its like how Dave Barnes use to deliberately swing his bow around like mad after a shot, and people tried to follow it without know he was just jerking them around if they copied him...
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  17. #11
    aka Ken Moylan slick's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flehrad View Post
    Unless your body, technique and skill is the same as his, why would you feel you should copy him?
    Does the same apply if he or Jim are using the standard (no such thing) Hoyt Grip. By the way which of the Ortho, Ergo and High Wrist Hoyt grips is the best?

  18. #12
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    Well, if you're just using factory stock, then you're not exactly changing to copy him, you're just using what it came with. Which is slightly different. I have no idea about which is 'best', I just use what comes from the factory.
    \"You want us to do WHAT?\" -- Ancient Chinese wall engineer

  19. #13
    digitus impudicus
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flehrad View Post
    Its like how Dave Barnes use to deliberately swing his bow around like mad after a shot, and people tried to follow it without know he was just jerking them around if they copied him...
    That sounds about right.. hahahaaaaaaa.
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  20. #14
    Recurve's Rule ! Leftnut's Avatar
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    Some people are missing the point, put your bow arm at your side then raise it up to shoulder hight with the elbow turned in a vertical position. You will see that your bow hand in it's correct position so then you modify your grip to keep the hand in that consistant position.
    As stated here in the write-up from my first post.
    To summarize, the foundation of the shot focuses on arranging the body and its component parts into the
    strongest and most stable configuration possible prior to the application of internal and external forces. This is
    accomplished by proper “load bearing” alignment that reduces fatigue and the potential for injury. Establishing
    stability will reduce movement during the shot and increase the archer’s sense of confidence. The foundation
    must, in every instance, be established precisely the same way every time to create consistency. The
    foundation also sets the tone for the shot and supports the shot, making it easier to execute and thus easier to
    duplicate. The design of this set of foundation positions is supported by carefully observed biomechanical and
    physical principles. It is the most efficient and effective way to perform an archery shot.
    Recurve's Rule !

  21. #15
    Learning the Ropes
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    Quote Originally Posted by slick View Post
    Ortho, Ergo and High Wrist Hoyt grips is the best?
    I would say it depends uniquely on you.


    I did not get along well with the stock GMX grip and the ortho did not work either. A very small amount of epoxy putty on the stock grip, just enough to build a small wedge on the left side (RH bow) being careful to keep it narrow (a virtue of it IMO) helped a lot: bow hand now just fits in place nicely and comfortably. And I benefit of the grip's small contact area (which was an issue with the ortho - for me at least).

    I agree with James Park that the grip should not used as a jury rig for bad hand placement. But the modification if done properly (and here lies the problem) may help. As in other cases one size just does not fit all.

    Cheers.

    Elder.


    The point
    Last edited by EVC; 26th April 2012 at 09:51 AM.

  22. #16
    Learning the Ropes
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    Quote Originally Posted by James Park View Post
    My point is:
    Hoyt (and others) make excellently shaped recurve grips (although I do not like the BEST grip - the angles are wrong).
    If you have a correctly positioned bow hand the force from the bow will be on the thumb muscle and from there directly onto the radio-carpal joint.
    If the force passes directly through that joint there will not be any tendence for your bow hand to slip, and you do not need rubber grips/etc or to change the shape of the grip to keep it in place. It is also the strongest position for your bow hand and minimises muscle use. In addition, it promotes the best position of the upper arm, giving optimal string clearance, and minimises use of the rotator cuff (and minimises the likelihood of injury).

    Usually when I see archers changing the shape of the grip it is because they have an incorrect bow hand position to start with.

    Same goes for compound bows - it is usually easily possible to get your bow hand in the correct position without making any modifications (at least it is for the Hoyts and many others). The most common error I see there is archers having their hand angle too vertical and the palm touching the grip.
    hoyt makes many different grips. some stores even let you choose which grip you want your bow delivered with. variations in human anatomy (which are common) mean different people will perform best with different shaped grips. getting a new commercial grip will cost about $30 a pack of epoxy putty will cost you $10and will give you more than you need. and you don't need to know exactly what shape you need, you can experiment some, and even choose a size between the commercial ones.

    the fact that some among the worlds elite do it doesn't mean i should. it means if i feel the need it isn't a stupid thing to consider.

  23. #17
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    What if we had been wrong about the modified rubber grips all along? We've always discussed the issue of torque from a purely mechanical mindset, which is ok. But statistics say that most archers in Asia prefer taping up their modified grips with some kind of tennis grip tape. In fact those who don't, appears as being different, and usually aren't in the highest scoring bunch. All we know from them is this: they don't like their grips to slip. James has it right that a correct grip position is one that has the bones and joints well aligned, what are the chances that several of the world's top archers who is grip tapes disagree with him on this?

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  24. #18
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    Like everything else in life. If you do the same thing again and again, you will get the same result.
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  25. #19
    Been there, Done it! stejac's Avatar
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    Mmmm ....

    ..... James has it right that a correct grip position is one that has the bones and joints well aligned .......

    Perhaps those that have issues with the above might get a better understanding of his point of view by obtaining a copy of the medical text "Gray's Anatomy" and looking at the wrist & arm/shoulder structure of the human form.

    As has been said above 'everybody' has slightly different builds for various (genetic?) reasons ... some people have had injuries from previous incidents or accidents ... some carry deformities (like scoliosis) through life ... what this means is that sometimes postures and grips and all sorts of other things have to be compromised so we can continue with our sport.

    In my view it is very necessary that those who coach should know very well the technicalities of the human structure as well as the technicalities of archery so as to be able to offer the best advice to those they train.

    Cheers .....

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  27. #20
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    I'd actually recommend the very under rated "archery anatomy" by Ray Axford.
    You can currently purchase it and have it mailed to you for $15.60 all inclusive from bookdepository.com
    http://www.bookdepository.com/Archer.../9780285632653

    I think that this is probably the most badly named archery book out there. Only a small (but important) part of it is about how the bones all efficiently locate.
    The rest is about other important archery stuff which is of a high order.
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